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I plan to redo my kitchen this summer and would love to hear your experiences, pro and con, with
- Thread starter dianem
- Start date
steve2-in-la
Well-known member
Diane, kitchen is what we did this time last year. Finished in September-ish. . . be afraid.
Be VERY afraid.
If pressed, I'd say it was ultimately worthwhile but really, talk about stress! Also,talk about trying to murder the contractor and his "laborers" for gross incompetence . . . okay, let's NOT talk about that.
This link has some before and after shots of our project. If you have any questions, feel free. . .
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/steve2inla/album?.dir=/32f0&.src=ph
Be VERY afraid.
If pressed, I'd say it was ultimately worthwhile but really, talk about stress! Also,talk about trying to murder the contractor and his "laborers" for gross incompetence . . . okay, let's NOT talk about that.
This link has some before and after shots of our project. If you have any questions, feel free. . .
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/steve2inla/album?.dir=/32f0&.src=ph
I'm going to look at the photos now, but wanted to say that I know about the ordeal. Put on an
addition two years ago. It took one year to finish, twice the budget (cost nearly as much as the house) and two contractors, between which was two months of NO BUILDING AT ALL. Also cost us a friendship (1st contractor). Plan to keep kitchen limited to cabinets and countertop. Going to photos now.
addition two years ago. It took one year to finish, twice the budget (cost nearly as much as the house) and two contractors, between which was two months of NO BUILDING AT ALL. Also cost us a friendship (1st contractor). Plan to keep kitchen limited to cabinets and countertop. Going to photos now.
desertjean
Well-known member
From the professional's standpoint
1. Check out the contractor's license. (Most states have this information online.) In California, any project over a $500 value (labor & material combined) requires the contractor to be licensed. Several news stories recently have involved contractors who's licenses have been revoked and the customer would have known this with a two minute visit to our state's contractor licensing board's website. P.S., licensed and bonded go hand in hand here in CA. You have to be bonded to be licensed and it means nothing in an ad.
2. Don't ask the contractor to help you design it, have the design in hand first. There are plenty of good websites and home stores that will help with this. Then take your plan to your local city planning department to make sure an inspector isn't going to show up and make you take out all that lovely work because he didn't see how it went in. If the Contractor says "you can't do this" or "you shouldn't do that" then get another opinion.
3. There is no such thing as "Industry Standard" in construction. Although the term is thrown around, it means nothing. Everything should be spelled out in the contract and shown on the plans, do not assume anything. Do not expect that because you have indicate a sink you will have water and because you show a light switch there will be electricity. (This was my first lesson.)
4. Check for the state requirements for payment. This should be spelled out clearly in the contract. There is a maximum that the customer is allowed to pay and it is always well below the "50%" that many unscrupulous contractors like to charge. Have 10% set aside for "unforseen conditions." Until a wall opens up you just don't know what you will find. Get a second opinion if it starts to become a money pit. Red flags should be flying if the contractor keeps saying "I will need $X for this and $X for that" and you aren't seeing progress.
5. Assume that it will take twice as long, at least, as you think it should.
6. Ask who the subs will be. Many projects are held up because the electrical or mechanical sub is someone the contractor has never worked with before. If the contractor has a longstanding relationship with the subs they will tell you or you can ask for references.
Good luck!
1. Check out the contractor's license. (Most states have this information online.) In California, any project over a $500 value (labor & material combined) requires the contractor to be licensed. Several news stories recently have involved contractors who's licenses have been revoked and the customer would have known this with a two minute visit to our state's contractor licensing board's website. P.S., licensed and bonded go hand in hand here in CA. You have to be bonded to be licensed and it means nothing in an ad.
2. Don't ask the contractor to help you design it, have the design in hand first. There are plenty of good websites and home stores that will help with this. Then take your plan to your local city planning department to make sure an inspector isn't going to show up and make you take out all that lovely work because he didn't see how it went in. If the Contractor says "you can't do this" or "you shouldn't do that" then get another opinion.
3. There is no such thing as "Industry Standard" in construction. Although the term is thrown around, it means nothing. Everything should be spelled out in the contract and shown on the plans, do not assume anything. Do not expect that because you have indicate a sink you will have water and because you show a light switch there will be electricity. (This was my first lesson.)
4. Check for the state requirements for payment. This should be spelled out clearly in the contract. There is a maximum that the customer is allowed to pay and it is always well below the "50%" that many unscrupulous contractors like to charge. Have 10% set aside for "unforseen conditions." Until a wall opens up you just don't know what you will find. Get a second opinion if it starts to become a money pit. Red flags should be flying if the contractor keeps saying "I will need $X for this and $X for that" and you aren't seeing progress.
5. Assume that it will take twice as long, at least, as you think it should.
6. Ask who the subs will be. Many projects are held up because the electrical or mechanical sub is someone the contractor has never worked with before. If the contractor has a longstanding relationship with the subs they will tell you or you can ask for references.
Good luck!
carianna-in-wa
Well-known member
I've got to say, after living through a remodel...
that I would burn down the house, stomp on its ashes, and look for another before I'd live in a house during the time it was being remodeled.
Like Steve, I like the end results, but living through it during construction is more than I would ever do again.
My only advice is to make sure that you don't go with a "cost plus percentage" contract with your contractor. We found out the hard way that the contractor has no incentive under this model to control the cost of the subcontractors.
Good luck! I hope you love your finished product!
that I would burn down the house, stomp on its ashes, and look for another before I'd live in a house during the time it was being remodeled.
Like Steve, I like the end results, but living through it during construction is more than I would ever do again.
My only advice is to make sure that you don't go with a "cost plus percentage" contract with your contractor. We found out the hard way that the contractor has no incentive under this model to control the cost of the subcontractors.
Good luck! I hope you love your finished product!
Diane I don't have any experience comparing it with other surfaces (except Formica), but...
I absolutely love my granite countertop. I find upkeep is absolutely no issue. I've had it for 5 years. I was told don't spill oil on it, don't spill red wine on it because it will stain, and I did, and it didn't. I've even had oil and wine sitting on the counter overnight unnoticed and it never stained. I was a little paranoid about it when I first got it but I've learned that it can take just about anything. The only area where there's a little stain is under the soap dispenser next to the faucet. Generally it's a little wet there so the granite turns darker from being constantly wet. The dispenser hides it so you can't see it unless you pick up the dispenser. When we go on vacation for a couple weeks and it gets a chance to dry out, the stain disappears. It was sealed when it was installed, and they told me that I'd have to seal it again one day, but that day hasn't come yet, and apparently it's a fairly easy and inexpensive do-it-yourself procedure. They gave me a bottle of sealant with instructions, you just wipe it on. I've never used it though.
I absolutely love my granite countertop. I find upkeep is absolutely no issue. I've had it for 5 years. I was told don't spill oil on it, don't spill red wine on it because it will stain, and I did, and it didn't. I've even had oil and wine sitting on the counter overnight unnoticed and it never stained. I was a little paranoid about it when I first got it but I've learned that it can take just about anything. The only area where there's a little stain is under the soap dispenser next to the faucet. Generally it's a little wet there so the granite turns darker from being constantly wet. The dispenser hides it so you can't see it unless you pick up the dispenser. When we go on vacation for a couple weeks and it gets a chance to dry out, the stain disappears. It was sealed when it was installed, and they told me that I'd have to seal it again one day, but that day hasn't come yet, and apparently it's a fairly easy and inexpensive do-it-yourself procedure. They gave me a bottle of sealant with instructions, you just wipe it on. I've never used it though.
Mimi, have you ever had lemon juice "burn" into your granite?
I have a granite pastry "board" dropped into my kitchen island- I can take it out and refrigerate before rolling stuff out. It is not sealed. My husband cut lemons on it and now it has white "stains" but it seems to be deeper than just a surface stain. I cannot get them out- any idea on what to try using?
I have a granite pastry "board" dropped into my kitchen island- I can take it out and refrigerate before rolling stuff out. It is not sealed. My husband cut lemons on it and now it has white "stains" but it seems to be deeper than just a surface stain. I cannot get them out- any idea on what to try using?
You might find help here
http://doityourself.com/clean/marble.htm
http://doityourself.com/clean/marble.htm
http://doityourself.com/clean/marble.htm
http://doityourself.com/clean/marble.htm
carianna-in-wa
Well-known member
We're building a new house this summer and I've been drooling over the hard surfaces
but I know we just can't afford it now. We'll be installing laminate countertops to start with. They have some very nice ones that look "hard-surfacey." Luckily, countertops are an easy upgrade we can make in 5 years or so. It would be sooooo easy to fall into the mindset of "doing everything just right" at the start, but it's not realistic budget-wise for us.
We just added on a family room when we remodeled this house, and didn't change any countertop surfaces.
but I know we just can't afford it now. We'll be installing laminate countertops to start with. They have some very nice ones that look "hard-surfacey." Luckily, countertops are an easy upgrade we can make in 5 years or so. It would be sooooo easy to fall into the mindset of "doing everything just right" at the start, but it's not realistic budget-wise for us.
We just added on a family room when we remodeled this house, and didn't change any countertop surfaces.
Granite vs. other coverings
Remodeled the kitchen a year ago. Put granite (a real granite, be careful because I found that many places call granite any naturally occurring stone which can be stained by red wine, or tomatoes or damaged by acids) in the center island and formica on the surrounding cabinets. Love it. No special maintenance required, but would not cut on the granite as it is not good for the knives.
The adventure took considerably longer than we were told by the contractor, but I would do it again. Plan for some surprises and changes of mind once you get going.
Remodeled the kitchen a year ago. Put granite (a real granite, be careful because I found that many places call granite any naturally occurring stone which can be stained by red wine, or tomatoes or damaged by acids) in the center island and formica on the surrounding cabinets. Love it. No special maintenance required, but would not cut on the granite as it is not good for the knives.
The adventure took considerably longer than we were told by the contractor, but I would do it again. Plan for some surprises and changes of mind once you get going.
we're just finishing our counters......
1st - congrats Steve, it's looks beautiful!
when I was ready to start on the counters Steve was just starting his remodle and posted great info on various counter choices. (on Gail's)
we almost went with granite but I was having doubts about how it would look with the massive amount of counter surface I have.and how reflective it is. DH researched granite and not all is created equal. the one I wanted was porous and would have the staining probs mentioned by some of you. also, some of it cracks easily. I didn't care for the limited choice of the better grade.
I also didn't want tile due, again, to amount of counter surface. having said that, I found the most beautiful Italian porclean tiles! they look like natural stone and are soft, warm and inviting, in, what was, a large cold kitchen.
we got 18" tiles with 1/8" grout lines. the tiles do not have repeat pattern problems. from what Steve said, porclean is about the best you can have for counters as far as durability and staining goes. I'm over-the-top happy with how they look and everyone, including some contractor friends, just love them too.
we are getting a maple Boo's butcher block counter for the island, slighty lower than the counters are to allow for flow. I'm grateful that we didn't have to gut the kitchen. my needs are cosmetic. next is replacing the white laminate cabinet doors and I will be a happy camper!
best of luck with your re-d0
1st - congrats Steve, it's looks beautiful!
when I was ready to start on the counters Steve was just starting his remodle and posted great info on various counter choices. (on Gail's)
we almost went with granite but I was having doubts about how it would look with the massive amount of counter surface I have.and how reflective it is. DH researched granite and not all is created equal. the one I wanted was porous and would have the staining probs mentioned by some of you. also, some of it cracks easily. I didn't care for the limited choice of the better grade.
I also didn't want tile due, again, to amount of counter surface. having said that, I found the most beautiful Italian porclean tiles! they look like natural stone and are soft, warm and inviting, in, what was, a large cold kitchen.
we got 18" tiles with 1/8" grout lines. the tiles do not have repeat pattern problems. from what Steve said, porclean is about the best you can have for counters as far as durability and staining goes. I'm over-the-top happy with how they look and everyone, including some contractor friends, just love them too.
we are getting a maple Boo's butcher block counter for the island, slighty lower than the counters are to allow for flow. I'm grateful that we didn't have to gut the kitchen. my needs are cosmetic. next is replacing the white laminate cabinet doors and I will be a happy camper!
best of luck with your re-d0
It is so interesting to hear from you and Fruffy that there are grades of granite and imposter
granite. I have much to learn. I love the idea of tiles and having just done a floor, I know there are some amazingly beautiful choices. My question is this - in the past I have had tiles on small areas of counter space. I found it inconvenient for some things (such as writing on paper)because of the grout lines. At 1/8", yours are quite narrow and maybe that is the key. Do you experience any issues because of them? I love the idea. Thank you for the information.
granite. I have much to learn. I love the idea of tiles and having just done a floor, I know there are some amazingly beautiful choices. My question is this - in the past I have had tiles on small areas of counter space. I found it inconvenient for some things (such as writing on paper)because of the grout lines. At 1/8", yours are quite narrow and maybe that is the key. Do you experience any issues because of them? I love the idea. Thank you for the information.
hi Diane, since the tiles are 18" x 18" that isn't a problem. the..
tiles are lightly textured, giving them a more natural and organic look and feel. I didn't want tiles because of all the grout lines and the problems they create. however, because of the size ot the tiles and the very thin grout lines it's not an issue. we also used colored grout to go with the warm brown to cream tones of the tiles.
when choosing the tile, I pulled out what I liked at the store and brought home a sample of the tiles. I put them here and there to see how they went with everything and how the colors changed in my lighting and the changing sunlight. I lived with them for at least 24 hours until I eliminated all but one.
my husband did the tiling himself and it took longer than we anticipated but the end results are so worth it all! he just has the penisula to finish and it better be this weekend if intends stay happily married! '-))
if it's granite that is calling you, I can ask Don for the web address of this granite place we were going to order from. they ship already bull nosed slabs at a fraction of what it would cost to have a contractor. you can also get a box of samples (we did)so you can see what they really look like. Don also did a lot of research on the web about granite tops, which is how we found about the different probs some of them have. the one I fell in love with was prone to cracking and staining. in the end, I prefer the tile I ended up with as granite would be much too reflective in the summer for such a large space.
I'll post before and after pics when (if) we finally get it all together! good luck with your kitchen. it's exciting to plan your own dream kitchen.
tiles are lightly textured, giving them a more natural and organic look and feel. I didn't want tiles because of all the grout lines and the problems they create. however, because of the size ot the tiles and the very thin grout lines it's not an issue. we also used colored grout to go with the warm brown to cream tones of the tiles.
when choosing the tile, I pulled out what I liked at the store and brought home a sample of the tiles. I put them here and there to see how they went with everything and how the colors changed in my lighting and the changing sunlight. I lived with them for at least 24 hours until I eliminated all but one.
my husband did the tiling himself and it took longer than we anticipated but the end results are so worth it all! he just has the penisula to finish and it better be this weekend if intends stay happily married! '-))
if it's granite that is calling you, I can ask Don for the web address of this granite place we were going to order from. they ship already bull nosed slabs at a fraction of what it would cost to have a contractor. you can also get a box of samples (we did)so you can see what they really look like. Don also did a lot of research on the web about granite tops, which is how we found about the different probs some of them have. the one I fell in love with was prone to cracking and staining. in the end, I prefer the tile I ended up with as granite would be much too reflective in the summer for such a large space.
I'll post before and after pics when (if) we finally get it all together! good luck with your kitchen. it's exciting to plan your own dream kitchen.